Today we began discussing themes and how they have impacted "A Doll's House." Please choose a theme other than one that your group did and do the following:
1. Give 3 examples of the theme
2. How has this theme impacted 2 characters in the way they interact with each other?
3. Discuss the theme in relation to realism and what Ibsen was trying to prove about that time period.
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The theme that I chose is betrayal. The first example of betrayal was that Nora betrayed torvald when she borroed money and did not tell torvald. The second is that Nora just wanted money for christmas because she needs to pay her debt. Also she betrayes torvald by not telling him about the macaroons. The theme impacts Nora because she has had to lie to torvald this hole time. Also Nora because she has commited a crime with by forging he fathers hand writing instead of having him sign it in the firs place. Betrayal relates to realism by people betray others all the time and people do not find out. Ibsen was trying to prove that people betray others all the time in that period.
1. Give 3 examples of the theme
2. How has this theme impacted 2 characters in the way they interact with each other?
3. Discuss the theme in relation to realism and what Ibsen was trying to prove about that time period.
I am going to pick betrayal, because there is a lot in this story. In this story Nora betrays her husband by liying to him, and also barrows money with out telling him. This theme has impacted Nora and her husband because if Nora's husband findes out he is going to be furious. This theme also impacs Nora and her husband because Nora put her husbands name in jeperdy by borrowing money money.
I'm choosing the theme deception. A small example of this would be Nora lying to Torvald about the macaroons. Another, larger example would be how she borrowed money to take the trip to Italy. My last example of deception would be how Nora asked for money for Christmas, only so she could pay back the man she borrowed money from. The theme has impacted Nora and Torvald in a fairly negative way. Nora seems to live a life of lies, trying to keep certain things from Torvald. Nora has to watch the way she talks around Torvald, and inform her friends not to tell Torvald certain things. The theme of deception in relation to realism, and in the time period shows that women really didn't have a lot of freedom, or say in certain things. The fact that they had to hide things from their husbands in fear of punishment basically proves that.
The main theme which comes to my head other than the theme i did today would be betrayal. Many times in the story thus far there has been lying. Nora has lied about many things and has tried to get more money out of people when she isnt using it for what she really needed to. Her lying i think into the future story will come back and bite her just as when most people lie it comes back to them. Usually if you lie you are faced with the aftermath and i think nora is going to be in for some big aftermath from not only torbald but kilgore and other characters too. People from time to time do lie but when you think about it...it usually bite you hard in your butt. My best recomedation to nora would be to fess up and say the truth.
SCOTT ROTEMAN
SCOTT ROTEMAN
YES MR. KAY THIS IS SCOTT ROTEMANS!!!
The theme I will use is Betrayal. One example of betrayal in the story is when Nora bought some macacroons and did not tell Torvald. Another example is when Nora takes out the loan without Torvalds aproval. The third example is when she asks for moeny for christmas so she can pay off her debts. While Torvald has no idea any of this going on it impacts his and her relationship by keeping it together and calm. If Torvald knew this was going on im sure he would be very angry. t
This shows that back then betrayal wass common. Even though Nora did lie it was to save her husbands life supposedly she says. Everyone enjoys a nice vactation once in a while.
I chooose the teme betrayal. Some examples are the macoraons, the borrwing the money and how she acts like shes not smart. This has majorly impacted nora and her husband. Nora because she dont get to act how she would normaly she has to the act kind of un educated. And effects her husband because he thinks shes being her normal self. This is to realsism because everyone in everday life acts like this. Everyone this ot one another rather its big or small thats what going on in the story. And its not just our generation is has been always. You can tell this because hes writing about it so it must have been goin on back then alos.
Cody Dykes
The Theme I'm going to choose to do this on betrayal/deception as they go hand in hand with each other in the play. The first thing that happened in the play was Nora eating macaroon's and not telling Helmer, the next thing that came up was the fact that Nora owed krogstaf for a trip to Italy to help her husband, the last thing is that she forged her dad's name on the sheet for the loan. Of course it has a impact on the two main characters Norma and Helmer. There relationship rely solely on lies and deception. I think he was trying to shows that people arnt always truthful and people will do what they have to do to live, even if it's dirty or means going behind someone's back. This was a hard time and people wrote plays to get away from the horrors of real life and realism does the opposite. I think he was pretty brave to put this play together during the time.
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BTW
I think Scott R is a retard and deserves to fail this class for being a asshole to Mr. Kay today.
And that's what someone would do if they did not care
At least i try to put fourth effort
in my work even though i still suck at everything i do.
It just pisses me off i have to have the same grade as him
and i work harder than him.
Also his disrespect towards the person who decides
who decides if he passes or fails
this class.
WHAT A JOKE
A new theme I want to talk about is betrayl. There are several examples such as when Nora lied to Torvald about eating/buying macaroons. Another is how Nora borrowed money form Krogstad to save Torvalds life. Lastly, Ms.Lind married her "late" husband just to support her family. I think Iben wanted people to see the role of women in a relationship. Also, he wanted to show how every relationship has their own secrets. He tried to relate everyday life to his story. In doing so, I think he proved to people that women deserve a stronger role in the relationship.
The theme i picked is betrayal. This theme is the most common theme in the story this far. It starts when Nora lies to Torvald about the macaroons. She completely betrayed him because she was a spendthrift. If he was to know that she bought the macaroons he would feel betrayed. Also when Nora lied to Torvald about the money for the trip. In reality she borrowed the money. Another example is that she wants money for Christmas to spend on herself. In reality she wants it to pay the money she owes. I think the two characters that this has brought together is Nora and Torvald. If Nora was to tell the truth her and Torvald may not be together.
Deception is my theme for today. Nora is always acting like everything is happy and perfect, where in reality she is worried, and afraid. Nora also acts like her friend, Christine, brought the macaroons, when really she bought them. Third, she acts like she is a spend thrifts when she is taking the money to pay off her loan. This theme imacted Christine because she went along with it and took the blame even though she really didn't want to. It shows that she is a friend with Nora. Still to this day, friends still take blame for their other friend's wrong-doings. It will probably be going on forever.
The theme that I have chosen is betrayal. The main person that does this theme is Nora. She lied straight to Torvald about her not eating macaroons. Then she lied about not borrowing money from anyone. My third example is that Mrs. Linde betrayed her husband she never loved him. Betrayal impacts Nora and Torvald the most. He thinks she has been honest with him, when she is lying to him. This theme relation to realism is that people that you trust the most can be the ones that you can't trust at all.
1. Give 3 examples of the theme
2. How has this theme impacted 2 characters in the way they interact with each other?
3. Discuss the theme in relation to realism and what Ibsen was trying to prove about that time period.
The theme that i picked is betrayel. the first example of betrayel is how Nora lies to him about the macaroons. The second example is how she borrowed money when Taurvald didnt no about it. Th last example is how Nora acts like she is dumb but she is actually pretty smart. This theme impacts the way the two characters act around eachother because Taurvald knows when she is lying. This just makes there relationship worse and worse everytime she lies. Ibson was trying to prove that in the time period the man runs the household. He is also trying to prove that everything doesnt turn out how it should.
I chooose the teme betrayal. Some examples are the macoraons, the borrwing the money and how she acts like shes not smart. This has majorly impacted nora and her husband. Nora because she dont get to act how she would normaly she has to the act kind of un educated. And effects her husband because he thinks shes being her normal self. Even though Nora did lie it was to save her husbands life supposedly she says. Everyone enjoys a nice vactation once in a while. Even though Nora did lie it was to save her husbands life supposedly she says. Everyone enjoys a nice vactation once in a while.
I'm going to jump on the bandwagon and choose to write on the theme of deception as it is the most outstanding of the play thus far.
The first example of deception that we see in this story is by Nora when she deceives Mr. Helmer in believing that she hadn't purchased the macaroons that she loves (and later in the story says that Mrs. Linde brought them over). The second example we see is the deception of Nora flat-out lying to Torvald about the money that she had amassed for his trip to make him well once more for she told her husband that her father had granted her the money when, in truth, Krogstad had given it to her. A third example of this theme is the deception of forgery that has plagued Mr. Krogstad and caught Nora in a trap. Nora had told Krogstad that her father had signed off on the contract, so to speak, that Krogstad had written her in order for him assure that he got his money back after loaning it to her. When Krogstad confronted Nora at the end of Act I, we learn that Nora forged her father's signature a few days after his passing, thus deceiving Krogstad.
Clearly this theme impacts the relationship that Nora has with her husband in that she hides things from him and unjustly so. Sure, she lied about saving his life which one can see as both a good and a bad thing, but she should simply tell him that she had borrowed the money even if it goes against her husband's wishes. This also affects the relationship between Nora and Krogstad as the latter now knows of Nora's forgery and has attempted to use it against her by telling Torvald of her ruse. I think that Nora's deceiving creates a dissonance within herself and that she feels that she must cunningly lie in order to maintain a balance within.
I think that Ibsen was trying to prove that deception is a common anti-moral, so to speak, of the society at the time of his writing. Such deception still exists in today's society, as people lie, cheat, and steal their way in and out of things simply to maintain a peaceful environment it seems. Nora does not lie to her husband without reason. She seems to do it so that there is less fighting between them, thus creating a harmonious outward appearance but a dissonant inward one within her.
- Ryan Moore.
Houghtaling
the main and ever so evident theme in this play i feel is betrayal. not just from nora, but from almost everyone in the play. mainly, yes, nora is the most prolific lier in the play, first, because of her macaroons. second, nora lies to torvald and tells him that she recieved money from her father. she also committed a crime by forging her fathers signature. next, krogstad uses this against nora to hold his position at the bank. an obscure, but obvious sign of betrayal. this relates to realism, because it shows the real tactics and ays people use to interact. not the often romanticized veneer of other books.
The theme I decided to write about is betrayl. One example of this theme is the way Nora lies to her husband about almost everything. Another lie she told was about borrowing money without her husbands premision. The next person is Torvald that was betrayed by Nora about they whole relationship. I feel like they are complete opposites. This has impacted them both and makes them uneasy around each other. It is like that have to pull to get any information out, but it seems to never be the truth. I beilive that this can relate to real life because you can see many people betraying their husbands and wifes. This usely leads to divorce which is why the percent rate is now 50-50. Ibsen is trying to say people can betray one another in life.
The main theme that I have noticed thus far throughout "A Doll's House" is Deception. The first example of deception is when Nora is asked by Torvald if she has ate macroons and says no, but she is lying to him. Nora feels like she has to lie about something so simple because if he found out she would have been infuriated that she had not listened to what he says to do or in this case, no do. The second example of deception is when Torvald is sick and Nora borrows money to take a trip to Italy. It is deceptive because she does not tell him she is borrowing money, which is forbidden in Torvald's eyes. The third example of deception is when Nora begs Torvald for money for her Christmas present. The shady part is that she wants the money so she can pay off what she had borrowed for the trip. This theme has greatly impacted Nora and Torvald's marriage because little does Torvald know, Nora is hiding so many lies from him. Their relationship is extremely unhonest which is not really fair to either of them in my eyes. Deception has alot to do with realism because it is proving how small of a role women had in society, as well as marriage. The women in that period of times job was to be taking care of the home while the male was to go out and make the money. In Torvald and Nora's relationship Torvald treats Nora like one of the children and she is basically to be seen, and not heard. I think that period of time is so unequal and I am so grateful things are not like that anymore.
The theme of sexism has come up countless number of times throughout the story "A Doll's House" so far. The first time I think is starts to appear is when Nora is trying to hide from her husband the maccaroons and he keeps qestioning her on it like she is a little kid. There realtionship seems to be based upon a more "master and the pet" sort of basis. Where Nora is the pet, and Torvald is the master constantly talking down to Nora. Torvald treats Nora as though she is a child and like he is much higher than her because he is a man. In their society, that is te way things went though, woman had to play the role of giving the men all the power they could. Mrs. Linde has a difficult time finding a new job after losing her first one because she is a woman, and most jobs are sort of reserved for the men first. Torvald has to constantly remind Nora not to spend the money he has ben earning on pointless things that are not needed, and to save money so that in the end they would never have to borrow. Torald treats Nora like it is his hard earned money and he has to constantly monitor the way she is using it like a child and treats her with little respect. Sexism really creates huge gap in the realtionship between Nora and Torvald because she feels as though it is her role to let all the power go to her husband, and her to take little control over dcisions. There relationship seems to have little romance what so ever, because of the fact that society has told them that basically woman must bow down to the men and let them tell the woman what to do. Sexism was such a real thing in their society during the time in which this story took place, and played a huge role in families lives. Sexism is still a real issue after all these years, and it still goes on, not nearly as much in the open and as dramtic, but forms of sexism definitely still do take place today.
Honor:
1. Nora shows honor about lieing to Torvald about how she got the money.
2. Nora lies about how she spends money to keep her heroic act a secret.
3. Nora feels honorable for saving Torvalds life.
This theme impacts Nora and Torvalds relationship alot. It makes her feel she is extremely special, but he doesnmt even know. Honor is somthing we all strive for. We want to be noticed but sometimes its best to do the good dead and not take credit for it. In reallife people do this for the recognisition or just for the self-honor and knowing what they did.
Ah, this should be quite simple as I was not here for practically the entirety of the hour. In that light, my theme for tonight shall be sexism. Sexism is the underlying theme for the entire story even though it is not as blatantly obvious as betrayal. Sexism is evident everywhere, in Torvald's demeaning attitude and his pet names, even to Ibsen's portrayal of Nora is slightly sexist. What I mean by that is Nora is what a man would consider a "typical woman" on the outside. She loves to spend, is somewhat ditzy in how she talks and is totally self-absorbed. She only talks about herself to Ms. Linde and is obsessed with finery. Yes, she may be borrowing money to pay back her debt to Krogstad, but she still would like to spend spend spend! You can see this in the macaroons, and her aforementioned obsession with "nice" things. A third example is Rank's treatment of her, which is similar to Torvald's, simply without the pet names. They all basically treat her as a dumb-ass.
The biggest impact this theme has is between Nora and Torvald. Is is most evident in the end of the book, with what Nora does and her reasons for doing so. Torvald berates her and treats her like a doll, and Nora in turn doesn't think the world of Torvald because she knows how she treats him. So, it seems that Nora goes out of her way to defy Torvald's wishes.
This theme in relation to realism is trying to make he statement that men were rampantly sexist in the 19th century. Women were considered nothing more that baby- and home-makers. He shows how ridiculous it is and how women can see it and want it to change, as symbolized by Nora's actions at the end of the play.
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BTW, what's with the hating on each other? I guess I missed something. But something YOU all missed was when Jenna came over and we were working on her paper, we found the BIGGEST peanut I've ever seen in the bowl and it was the best peanut we've ever ate.
I think deception is shown a lot so far in the story. Nora does this by buying the maccroons when she knows Torvald doesnt want her to have them. Then she lies about buying and eating them to Torvald when he questioned her. The next big thing Nora does to show deception is borrowing the money for the vacation trip. Then once again lying about it to Torvald and many other people. This theme has made Nora and Torvald's relationship and life i think full of lies. In Nora's case, one lie leads to another and soon eough she has a big pile of lies and doesnt know what to do with them. This theme is realted to realism because people lie everyday. Lies are told multiple times a day whether their small lies or big lies, their still lies and only create more problems in the near future. This occurs in everyday life and could be prevented if wanted to.
The theme that i am going to talk about is betrayal. Nora betrays Helmer when she eats the macaroons behind his back. She also betrays him when she borrows money without him knowing. A final example of betrayal is when Ms. Lind has an affair with Krogstad. This theme impacts Nora and Helmer because they have a secret life from each other and this can give way to future problems. This relates to realism because almost everyone has secrets. And not all secrets that people keep are bad some are good and are kept out of respect towards others.
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